Author Topic: Locomotive wheels  (Read 8983 times)

romiin

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Locomotive wheels
« on: July 15, 2021, 05:44:27 PM »
  Just curious why they made the loco wheels the way they did. They seem to be brittle on the edges and separate. Is there a reason they couldn't of been solid steel wheel.

starfire700

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Re: Locomotive wheels
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2021, 04:19:50 AM »
If you mean prewar diecast wheels, it is because of the nature of diecast metal.
Diecast was a cheap metal that most companies switched to from cast iron, during the 1920's and early 30's.
Diecast metal typically has impurities in it that when subjected to temperature and humidity changes over time, expands and contracts.
This expansion/contraction is what causes the cracks, pimpling, warp and eventual failure of the metal.
Weather or not companies knew of this eminent failure is unknown, but it was known that economy was a primary concern. Also diecasting allowed for better details to be produced.
And after all, they were just making toys, not what we would eventually call collector's items.
I recall seeing ads in 1940's vintage Model Builder magazine for replacement belly pans for Lionel 072 streamliners, so diecast failure happened sooner than we may have guessed.
Lionel must have suspected problems with diecast, yet they still trusted this material for their most important Loco, the 5344 / 700E Hudson.
Postwar locos continued to be diecast, yet I do not recall ever seeing a postwar loco that has diecast fatigue. They must have refined the process during WWII.
The main reason Lionel wheels changed to iron, starting 1950, is because it was required to work with Magne-Traction.   

pjdog350

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Re: Locomotive wheels
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2021, 09:24:53 AM »
A friend (Dick Mitchell) that I had when I lived in Louisiana said the failure of casting was due to the material and the % of material used caused the failure. Even some Hudsons had casting fail.  Something to do with the lead in the casting. Maybe the percentage of lead used. I think maybe they where in a learning curve with castings? I was not sure I should post with this cause I really don’t know but.
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Terry

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Re: Locomotive wheels
« Reply #3 on: July 16, 2021, 12:12:55 PM »
I understand it to be that if there was any lead in the mixture it will fail.

If you look at the different casting marks some houses never fail - this is said to be because they did not do castings with lead. The bases for 57 and 58 streetlamps are good examples of clean castings.

A lot of the McCoy trains and repro wheels from the mid 1970s are now junk because the castings failed.

This is called zinc pest.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_pest

That article says manufacturers knew of the problem by 1923.

Speaking of this, on Wednesday I saw a prewar Marklin 800SK loco with a solid casting on both the loco and tender. I've never seen one that wasn't in peices. Few Marklin HO locos from before 1950-52 survive the zinc pest. For the better locos like the crocodile,  collectors will buy many damaged peices to put together a nice one. This one was purchased used by a US soldier in late 1945. The son said his dad came home in Jan of 1946.

pjdog350

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Re: Locomotive wheels
« Reply #4 on: July 16, 2021, 01:50:54 PM »
Thanks Terry. I’ve always wondered what the case was. I saw a Lionel scale old prewar Hudson that had the problem in a museum in New Orleans.
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